outdeep
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« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2003, 05:33:49 pm » |
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Yes. The Assembly did use technology when it was useful. They used an electronic typesetter in printing before the computer revolution made the practice obsolete.
My exagerated comment below was in once sense a joke, but in another sense it pointed to a truth. I have heard ministry many times that went like:
"Where you do you read in the Bible that the church formed denominations? Where do you read about paid clergy? Where do you read about the World Councel of Churches? Where do you read about parachurch or mission organizations? etc."
But, then we did things that appeared to have superficial Scriptural support - monthly workers meetings, park outreaches, box on the back table. And others that clearly did not have any clear Scriptural mentions(other than, perhaps, spritualized "forced" ones) - children's ministry, youth ministry, Christian school, tent meetings, printing ministry, Juvenile ministry, Christmas projects, couples meetings, brother's houses, sister's houses, training apartments, All Saints fun day, coffee houses, campus ministry, campus conference, annual seminars, etc.
The simple point is that Biblical silence does not necessarily mean something is wrong to do. The Bible is the revelation of God and where we find many of God's opinions and commands. But, it is not the only source of good ideas. Nor does it claim to be.
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Kimberley Tobin
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« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2003, 08:23:25 pm » |
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We also taped the meetings, and they didn't have tape recorders in the Bible. There was a lot of paranoia about people getting ahold of the tapes. A few meetings, I was actually told to destroy the tapes. It was usually when it was about child training. I did erase the tape, but I still have an encrypted mp3 file sitting around. I don't know if I remember the password, and I'm not sure I care.
Although the Brethren concept of not doing something if not in the Bible was given as an excuse, I think the real activites were just whatever was needed to perpetuate the assembly system.
Dave
My husband and I had a man living in our home who had 25 years worth of tapes in our homes. At various times during his living with us (close to 7 years) the leadership was very concerned about the amount of tapes this man had. At one point early in our marriage (even before this man lived with us) the "head" leading brother asked my husband and I to take responsibility for "overseeing" this brothers' tape ministry (who were we to do this to this mans' ministry, btw  ). We were told to "destroy" the tapes after people had listened to them. There was to be about a 1-2 week "recycling" of the tapes in order to assure that the ministry would not be kept on tape. We didn't do it. What is particularly interesting to my husband and I was that after we left (October 9, 2002), the leadership was CONSIDERABLY concerned about having these tapes in OUR garage. After something appeared on this web-site that was clearly from taped ministry, three brothers appeared at our home and carted off every single tape that was in our garage. (We DO have COPIES!!!  ) They promptly moved this brother out of our home the following weekend. WHAT WERE THEY SO CONCERNED ABOUT?  ?? Doesn't it make anybody who continues to associate with them (whether they are "meeting" or not) a little bit curious as to why they don't want these tapes public? If this is "heavenly vision" don't you want to SHOUT IT FROM THE ROOFTOPS? I remember when I first got saved, I thought, "Why doesn't anybody report this on the 6:00 pm news? Come on, if this is salvation for the world, why didn't anybody tell me?"  We all know the answer! |
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2003, 09:00:34 pm by Kimberley Tobin »
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outdeep
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« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2003, 08:37:42 pm » |
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Official reason: We don't want the tapes getting into the wrong hands and George's words twisted.
Imagine my surprise when I visited Calvary Church of Santa Ana and realized for the first time that I could purchase any one of the pastor's sermons for a nominal cost.
The contrast of these two different perspectives was not lost on me.
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2003, 08:46:38 pm by Dave Sable »
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M2
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« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2003, 08:46:22 pm » |
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Dave, I emailed this link to a number of individuals. My husband read the article and enjoyed it so much that he sent it to a number of other individuals. My husband has also read the book that you recommend and says that it has helped him tremendously. PROOF that the website is helpful to ex-Geftakysites. Lord bless, Marcia |
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editor
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« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2003, 10:02:52 pm » |
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I was about to come up with some stuff to put on it, when the "brethren" discovered your (Brent's) website. I was told to immediately take it down. They were afraid that you would put a link to our website, and people would be able to associate us with what you (Brent) were talking about. That's what I'm talking about! Fact: San Diego WAS associated with Geftakys Fact: The Leaders knew that the truth wasn't pretty Fact: They chose to deal with the truth by making it hard for people to link them with Geftakys, when in fact they were totally linked. Poor people! I am so glad that they're free now. Brent |
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d3z
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« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2003, 12:05:27 am » |
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Fact: San Diego WAS associated with Geftakys
Fact: The Leaders knew that the truth wasn't pretty
Fact: They chose to deal with the truth by making it hard for people to link them with Geftakys, when in fact they were totally linked.
I'm fairly sure, at the time, that the leaders weren't much aware of the truth of the website. There was a lot of spin control passing the website off as divisive lies. It really wasn't until a worker from Fullerton called another worker down here and said to "Read the website, it is all true" that the leaders really even looked at the website. So it was more of, they knew the website was bad (they didn't know what it said). They were afraid to even find out what it said, so they never looked into it. I thought it was weird about not wanting to be linked to. I kind of passed it off, at the time, as people not understanding how the web worked. What's said is that I went along with all of this, even about thinking that "the website" was just a bunch of lies. I remember reading about the speculation of where the money went, and seeing a suggestion of a basement, and therefore I knew it couldn't be true. I looked for whatever possible detail I could find wrong and used that as an excuse to dismiss the whole thing. I did this for several years. Dave |
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editor
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« Reply #36 on: November 07, 2003, 12:19:34 am » |
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What's said is that I went along with all of this, even about thinking that "the website" was just a bunch of lies. I remember reading about the speculation of where the money went, and seeing a suggestion of a basement, and therefore I knew it couldn't be true. I looked for whatever possible detail I could find wrong and used that as an excuse to dismiss the whole thing. I did this for several years.
I read that first RickRoss article, about the bars of gold kept somewhere in the house and just laughed! How ridiculous. However, in January 2003, someone went to George's house to retrieve a piece of furniture that was in his house. When they were removing it, they found 10,000.00 in cash secreted away inside the furniture. (not in a drawer, but sort of hidden in some way.) Perhaps the gold bars aren't that far off? I know several people who own gold, and keep it in a safe inside their houses. It's no crime. However, I don't know too many people who keep 10,000.00 cash hidden inside furniture. Brent
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Uh Oh
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« Reply #37 on: November 07, 2003, 02:37:16 am » |
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I'm fairly certain that the apostles never used computers, web browsers, or the internet. Here's our "true" motivation to shut down the BB, it is unbiblical.
Dave
This kind of "assembly logic" brings back a ton of memories. Please note that I recognize the sarcasm - and find it funny. I remember when I was about 6 or 7, and some of the "brothers" took a few of us to a Harlem Globetrotters Basketball Game. At the end of the game, we wanted to go down and get autographs. The "brothers" logic for not letting us do this was that you never read about the apostles or the disciples getting Jesus Autograph, so he didn't think it would be right for us to get the Globetrotters autographs. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't emotionally harmed or whatever from this incident, its just kind of funny how assembly life affected seemingly normal adults!!! |
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summer007
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« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2003, 05:08:50 am » |
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Ok..regaring the church not taking a name ..I dont want to beat a dead horse...but I thought it was the stupidest thing about the place or was it??? YOU'd invite someone out to your church and they'd say oh, whats the name of it and you'd say well, we really dont have a name we call it the Assembly ..were just Christians...I remember hearing this and thought this is hard to get my mind around....could it have been GG's way of not taking responsibility for the place afterall he'd have to have filed the name to keep it in effect therefore it would be registered or anyone could use the name and then he could in effect be held responsible meaning he could be Sued for whatever.. and Why have it in his sons or another brothers name they could be excommunicated on a whim...whoevers name would be on the NAME would have the Box and the Responsibility ...GG probibly thought if they buy this theory of No Name they'll in effect Buy anything ....This is what I believe it was all about the Money and not being Sued....That's why he rented or the bros rented buildings instead of buying so his name was'nt on anything...so if they're ever was a blow-up he could say he does'nt know anything were all just brothers...hum....it goes right along with Christmas gifts and college funds....more $$$for him....
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editor
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« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2003, 05:44:16 am » |
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Ok..regaring the church not taking a name ..I dont want to beat a dead horse...but I thought it was the stupidest thing about the place or was it??? YOU'd invite someone out to your church and they'd say oh, whats the name of it and you'd say well, we really dont have a name we call it the Assembly ..were just Christians...I remember hearing this and thought this is hard to get my mind around....could it have been GG's way of not taking responsibility for the place afterall he'd have to have filed the name to keep it in effect therefore it would be registered or anyone could use the name and then he could in effect be held responsible meaning he could be Sued for whatever.. and Why have it in his sons or another brothers name they could be excommunicated on a whim...whoevers name would be on the NAME would have the Box and the Responsibility ...GG probibly thought if they buy this theory of No Name they'll in effect Buy anything ....This is what I believe it was all about the Money and not being Sued....That's why he rented or the bros rented buildings instead of buying so his name was'nt on anything...so if they're ever was a blow-up he could say he does'nt know anything were all just brothers...hum....it goes right along with Christmas gifts and college funds....more $$$for him....
Brother George? Only about money? What about sex and power? |
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summer007
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« Reply #40 on: December 22, 2003, 06:00:42 am » |
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Yeah ,sex and power too...At one point in time...my chair was right across from him on sunday mornings and I thought he looked at me funny a few times ..but I shook it off...thinking I was having impure thoughts ..an attack from the Enemy...you know...
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jesusfreak
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« Reply #41 on: December 26, 2003, 08:34:28 am » |
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I usually found myself explaining the non-name through acknowledgment of the existence of a simplicity where believers "met in a home to worship God and study the bible together" - ie, the perfected definition of a non-denominational house church.
[rant]
IMO, the Assembly was a universe built on both ideals and preconceptions; although totally infatuated with the imagination of a single Man. It is this inherent flaw that remain prevalent, however subtly, within current groups. While I recognize my notable lack in terms of not having experienced *every* gathering in order to make blanket statements, leading for the previous statement to only be accepted as my personal opinion - the simple fact that we *were* rolling in mud is sufficiently conducive to lead even the most anal retentive of thinkers to realize that comparing ourselves to each other for "cleanliness" a rather intellectly bankrupt practice. In this case, moving on to proven, healthy churches can be the only perfected solution.[/rant]
hehe, perhaps I went a bit outside the scope of this thread with that sentiment *shrug*
--
lucas
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Scott McCumber
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« Reply #42 on: December 26, 2003, 08:42:19 am » |
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Lucas, Interesting thought about not being able to compare an experience when you have nothing to compare it to. Wish I had said something like that before. You've come a long way in a year, bro! Glad you're back. |
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M2
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« Reply #43 on: December 26, 2003, 09:42:52 am » |
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In Canada No-Name is registered by Sunfresh Foods, so we couldn't say we were a no-name church because that would actually be a 'name'  . Now that I look back, it is kind of silly the things we 'stood for'. So many picky details to worry about and all it accomplished was that we isolated ourselves from the greater Christian community. Mingling was akin to ecuminism. And ecuminism was... However though some of the existing assemblies now choose to take a name, it is not necessarily because they have re-evaluated the teaching on why we didn't in the first place. The outward appearance may be somewhat difference from before, but I agree that what will truly bring about real change for those who are "in" is for them to move on to proven healthy churches. Lord bless, Marcia |
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Oscar
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« Reply #44 on: December 27, 2003, 02:48:44 am » |
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It took me just a few weeks to figure out that the name of the church with no name was, "The Assembly".
That is what everyone involved constantly called it. They criticized people for leaving "The Assembly". They rejoiced when someone committed themselves to fellowship in, "The Assembly" and so on.
I always thought it was a little nutty.
Tom
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