Sickening "God Talk"

[editor]

One of the things I learned in the Assembly was how to talk like an Assembly person.

When I first joined I would greet people like a normal person, "Hey Mark, how's it going?  Did you surf this morning?"

Then I learned to say,  "Praise the Lord, brother.  Are you rejoicing?"  (Actually I didn't say this too much, but most people around me talked like this exclusively.)

I used to pray in very simple ways,  "Dear Heavenly Father, I just pray that we would have a safe trip...in Jesus' name, Amen."

After a few months it became,  "Our gracious and loving Heavenly Father, from whom the whole family in heaven and earth has been named.  Who alone dwells in in-approachable light, who is the father to the fatherless, the one who remains faithful and true, the blessed God and Father of our dear Lord Jesus Christ....blah blah blah....I pray this in the matchless name of our exalted Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ."

Anyways, you all get the picture.  I have come to the place where I call this sort of talk the language of hypocrisy.  No one speaks like this, for real. The only people this sort of talk impresses are fellow hypocrits, and the flowery language certainly isn't for God's benefit.  This sort of thing makes me sick, and it's one the most repulsive pieces of baggage that many of us hung on to when we left the Assembly.

I am so happy that the church I fellowship at speaks like normal people when they pray, and don't have much sanctimonious God Talk.  I couldn't bear it if they did.

I'm just going to lay this out here, so that some of you can petition Our Great High Priest on my behalf.  The faithful prayer of a righteous man avails much, so in the mighty name of Our Lord Jesus Christ  please beseech the Most High on my behalf.

When certain people "entreat" me using this kind of language I do two things.  I laugh out loud and mock them, then I read what they wrote to Suzie and she berates them and asks me, "Why do you still waste your time on that board with those stupid people?"  Please note, she doesn't mean all of you are stupid, just the one's who specialize in God Talk and the nit-picky arrogant judgementalism that goes with it. 

So, if you want me to buckle under the pressure of my wife, and finally once and for all forsake this BB, you only need send me messages and email laced with God Talk and sissy-boy language about how my speech should be more moderate and reflective of the kindness and mercy shown to us in the Person of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.  I know that it would make some of you quite happy if I wasn't here, so please feel free to send me a bunch of Assemlby talk.  Better yet, address some "encouragements" to my wife, in which you quote several verses and go on in vague terms about God and some aspect of His Character that makes me look like I need to become more Christ-like.  That will seal the deal, guaranteed.

In the meantime, please be warned that while I love discussion, and really love controversial discussion, I am totally repulsed by an argument that is based on how my "tone" doesn't reflect this or that aspect of "Our blessed Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."  I can't stand it, and I will publicly mock anyone who tries to pull this crap  (yep, I said crap) on me. 

If you don't agree with me, or think I'm wrong, I will respect you for coming out and saying so.  But I won't play the Assembly entreaty game, where we all agree to dance a certain way when we bring up certain verses prior to making a vague criticism of each other. 

Many believe that the language we use not only reflects the way we think, but actually causes us to think in certain ways.  For instance, it is fairly well established that if our vocabulary is rudimentary and lacking we do not possess the ability to fully understand something of great beauty, or great importance.  It simply becomes "wow, that's awesome."  That being the case, people like this don't think great thoughts, or do great things, as a result.  They aren't able to, because their brains don't know what to do.  Kind of like being mathmatically illiterate.

In the same way, I believe those who adopt God Talk as their main language often fail to comprehend certain very important things, especially when the topic is unpleasant.  They immediately shut off their brains and ears if a person of rough speech tries to communicate.

Too bad.

Oh, people also think God Talkers are wierd.  Saturday Night Live did a good job mocking them....it was funny because it was true.

Brent

[vernecarty]

One of the things I learned in the Assembly was how to talk like an Assembly person.

When I first joined I would greet people like a normal person, "Hey Mark, how's it going?  Did you surf this morning?"

Then I learned to say,  "Praise the Lord, brother.  Are you rejoicing?"  (Actually I didn't say this too much, but most people around me talked like this exclusively.)

I used to pray in very simple ways,  "Dear Heavenly Father, I just pray that we would have a safe trip...in Jesus' name, Amen."

After a few months it became,  "Our gracious and loving Heavenly Father, from whom the whole family in heaven and earth has been named.  Who alone dwells in in-approachable light, who is the father to the fatherless, the one who remains faithful and true, the blessed God and Father of our dear Lord Jesus Christ....blah blah blah....I pray this in the matchless name of our exalted Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ."

Brent

Man I literally got goose-bumps reading this post.
There is a brother attending the church where I am now Brent and he is still praying exactly as you describe above. He used to be one of George's workers.
This same guy was calling up the Distrinct Superintendent telling him how he really supported the pastor the elders were trying to get to step down. while telling me another story to my face.
His explanation was that he did it because the pastor asked him to do it.
Some of these folk scare the hell out of me. CREEPY!
I must confess I have a very difficult time listening to this as it reminds me so much of the old days.
I know the man is sincere...it just give me the creeps...
Verne

p.s.  The points you are making highlight the impatience I have with people who want to keep on talking about all the good things about the assemblies...many of us got tainted in ways we  probably still even don't recognize at times...I too must actively and consciously rid myself of some of the putrid and revolting sanctimoniousness I learned during my stay there...I think that is part of the reason why I sometimes breathe fire..trying to leave my past perhaps? 
Verne

[editor]

Man I literally got goose-bumps reading this post.
There is a brother attending the church where I am now Brent and he is still praying exactly as you describe above. He used to be one of George's workers.
This same guy was calling up the Distrinct Superintendent telling him how he r4eally supported the pastor the elders were trying to get to step down. while telling me another story to my face.
His explanation was that he did it because the pastor asked him to do it.
some of these folk scare the hell out of me. CREEPY!
I must confess I have a very difficult time listening to this as it reminds me so much of the old days.
I know the man is sincere...it just give me the creeps...
Verne

Jesus didn't talk like that.  He used contemporary idioms and expressions in his speech, and quoted verses in a straightforward manner.  Not at all like the scribes and pharisees.

I don't trust a person who has a public prayer language that he uses when he prays loudly in front of others.  I also dis-trust a person who always volunteers to share his testimony in public.  It just isn't normal, in my opinion.

Here's a funny story:

We visited a local church a while back, and after the service some people got up to testify.  As usual, most of them were women, who as part of their testimony gave ample praise to the pastor's wife.  One man got up and testified about how God saved him from the rough, sinful life of a motorcycle gang member, etc.  He was dressed like a reformed motorcycle gang member too.

Anyways, something about this guy didn't sit well with me, and because of that I remembered him clearly.  I distinctly remember that his hands were smooth and weak looking, not at all the sort of hands one would associate with a rough motorcycle gang guy.  He used about double the dosage of God Talk while sharing his testimony.

Well, recently we heard about a big gathering of Hog owners (Harley's) who were Christians.  When talking about this, Suzie said to the person, "Oh, does this guy go to ____church?  I think I know who it is."

The person responded like this, no kidding:  "Do you mean that guy who wears motorcycle jackets and always testifies in church?  That guy is a total poser.  He's the biggest faker around and I don't understand why they let him carry on like that all the time."

No one could speak Assembly-speak better than George....

nuff said.

Brent

[vernecarty]

That is indeed funny!
I believe the Lord showed me that I needed to repent of that nonsense...the Bible calls it great swelling words. People who carry on like that under the illusion that they are displaying their elevated holiness are simply showing their immaturity in my view.
The very fact that George himself prayed like that is enough to send me running for cover...
Verne

[editor]

That is indeed funny!
I believe the Lord showed me that I needed to repent of that nonsense...the Bible calls it great swelling words. People who carry on like that under the illusion that they are displaying their elevated holiness are simply showing their immaturity in my view.
The very fact that George himself prayed like that is enough to send me running for cover...
Verne

Yup.

Why would anyone want to let others know how spiritual they are?  I am serious.  What's to be gained from this?

Another way to look at this is to ask,  "Does a spiritually mature person care if others recognize his maturity?"

Brent

[summer007]

This happened to me recently. Someone on board felt they needed to defend and explain TM after I had a post or two that he did'nt agree with. It was very strange to me, because Tom of all people needs no-one to go to bat for him and he can defend himself. Yet this person, felt they had to entreat me, and pulled the whole Leading Bro scenerio on me, it was really a turn-off. I decided I did'nt want to talk to any former LB's, and stayed off for four months, plus I did'nt want to "waste" anymore time on this sort of non-sence, were all adults and have the right to our own opinions. I'd like to think the person was sincere, but I have my doughts.   summer

[editor]

This happened to me recently. Someone on board felt they needed to defend and explain TM after I had a post or two that he did'nt agree with. It was very strange to me, because Tom of all people needs no-one to go to bat for him and he can defend himself. Yet this person, felt they had to entreat me, and pulled the whole Leading Bro scenerio on me, it was really a turn-off. I decided I did'nt want to talk to any former LB's, and stayed off for four months, plus I did'nt want to "waste" anymore time on this sort of non-sence, were all adults and have the right to our own opinions. I'd like to think the person was sincere, but I have my doughts.   summer

Honestly, how sincere can a person be who uses fake, contrived language to communicate?

Tell me what sounds more sincere,

"John, I totally disagree with what you said to Sally.  What you said about her is just plain false, and you need to apologize.  She never did what you accused her of."

or...

"John, I want to entreat about keeping the unity and oneness of the Body of Christ.  You cannot keep the unity of the faith in the body of Christ by taking an adversarial tone toward those with whom you disagree. If there is heresy, name it. If there are lies, expose them. If there is false teaching, correct it. But if there is merely a personality conflict, as Ron recently suggested, ask questions instead of belittling whatever/whoever you don't like...

Please, I implore you to examine your heart before God and ask Him why you choose words that don't reflect the postive message of the Gospel of Our Lord Jesus Christ."

In the exceeding, matchless name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Brent

(The latter is real-life God Talk taken from my files.)

[summer007]

It was a Power-Play.  (most recognizable)

[editor]

It was a Power-Play.  (most recognizable)

I have found two things with relation to Assembly style power plays that are really interesting and wonderful in their own way.

The first, and by far the best, is when a former leader recognizes what they used to do and truly, humbly repents of it, and NEVER pulls another power play.  I know two people like this and every time I have contact with them I am blessed.

The other is when a former leader tries to pull a power play on a "sister" and she speaks up and puts him in his place in no uncertain terms!  That's a sight to see, no mistake.  The look on the LB-in-exile's face is priceless.  They don't know what to do, what to say, or what to think.  It's as if the laws of gravity were defied right in front of them.

Brent

[summer007]

Yes, priceless.

[vernecarty]

This happened to me recently. Someone on board felt they needed to defend and explain TM after I had a post or two that he did'nt agree with. It was very strange to me, because Tom of all people needs no-one to go to bat for him and he can defend himself. Yet this person, felt they had to entreat me, and pulled the whole Leading Bro scenerio on me, it was really a turn-off. I decided I did'nt want to talk to any former LB's, and stayed off for four months, plus I did'nt want to "waste" anymore time on this sort of non-sence, were all adults and have the right to our own opinions. I'd like to think the person was sincere, but I have my doughts.   summer

So that's where you were!!
I wondered what had happened to you Summer and really missed your participation.
Glad to see you back! 
Verne

p.s. not a leading brother and never was...
Verne

[vernecarty]

Yup.

Why would anyone want to let others know how spiritual they are?  I am serious.  What's to be gained from this?

Another way to look at this is to ask,  "Does a spiritually mature person care if others recognize his maturity?"

Brent

I have met a few men of God and I am sure you have too Brent, who were quiet and unassuming, but there was just something there. In spite of an incredibly gentle spirit, there was nonetheless a sense of spiritual authority that put you somewhat in awe. I remember during one of our CMA missions conferences an African brother Marurice Guindo from Mali who reminded me more of Christ than anyone I have ever met. While at my house for lunch, I watched the way he interacted with my little girls, especially Christina and could not help but think of Christ with the little children. I wanted to be like him!
Maybe  I will post a pic.

[vernecarty]

Honestly, how sincere can a person be who uses fake, contrived language to communicate?


"John, I want to entreat about keeping the unity and oneness of the Body of Christ.  You cannot keep the unity of the faith in the body of Christ by taking an adversarial tone toward those with whom you disagree. If there is heresy, name it. If there are lies, expose them. If there is false teaching, correct it. But if there is merely a personality conflict, as Ron recently suggested, ask questions instead of belittling whatever/whoever you don't like...

Please, I implore you to examine your heart before God and ask Him why you choose words that don't reflect the postive message of the Gospel of Our Lord Jesus Christ."

In the exceeding, matchless name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,

Brent

(The latter is real-life God Talk taken from my files.)

Say what??!!   
Verne

[summer007]

Good to know Verne. I'm sure you would of made a fine LB. Yet God in His mercy seems to have spared you. I really needed to back-off for awhile, just could'nt get my mind around certain mentalitys. summer.

[editor]

Say what??!!   
Verne

Yup. The entire first paragraph is word for word God Talk, sent to me as an entreaty.  Only names have been changed, to protect the innocent.

I tried the best I could to decipher it, and came up with the following:

"You aren't very nice when you talk about this stuff, and I am worried that someone might get upset by listening to you, because I get upset listening to you.  You come across too strong, and your positions are so strong that I fear you may actually stick to them and disagree with someone, which I find uncomfortable and unpleasant.  I think we should be nicer and less confrontational, like Our Glorious Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."

The part about error, false teaching and heresy I liked.  I just haven't figured out a way to talk about these things in a way that keeps the unity and oneness of the Body of Christ.  I am still stuck in the mentality that these things break the unity....not talking about them in a forceful manner.

Oh well.  It's just God Talk, no big deal.

Brent