Stand up for the VICTIMS!

[psalm51]

The bookstore date got around. I know that happened in other places as well. Yikes.

[jackhutchinson]

Lori,

Thanks for clarifying what you meant by "abuse".  I lived in Jeff's house for 3 years and Roberto's house for 4 1/2 months and I NEVER heard or saw any evidence of physical abuse (it never even entered my mind).  I agree, though, the advice we have been given about family relationships is horribly perverted.  I'm not married yet, but I hope by the time I do get married I will have somewhat of an idea of what a healthy family looks like.  I know it will take years to get rid of all the baggage from the assembly culture, but that my new life will be much better.

Jack

[editor]

Hello jack, Lori, John, Brad, Heide, Pat, and everyone else.

Yes, I also received plenty of "bookstore dating advice," from David Geftakys.  In my case, I like to surf.  There was this one beach, where the lineup was about a half mile offshore, and the shore was always littered with tons of kelp. (seaweed for you Nebraskans and Illinoisans...)

The flies were like fog on this beach. The waves were excellent, and there were no flies about 15 yards offshore.  Suzie had a hard time watching me surf, because I was so far away and the flies were so thick.  It smelled of rotting kelp too.  She hated that beach, and told me not to take her  there again.

David's advice was, "You don't want to marry a woman who won't follow you.  She needs to do what you want to do.  If you do what SHE wants, then she is going to lead you around like you have a ring in your nose."  When I asked him about "Fly Beach," his response was, "Tell her to build a fire."

I thought about this, and soon realized that what I really wanted was Suzie.  I was worried that if I treated her like David suggested, I just may not get her.  So I didn't take her to fly beach, but went there with my friends instead.  It was a good choice for me, and if you have ever seen my wife you will agree with me.

David was thrilled with me when I ended a date with Suzie after ten minutes.  We got in the car, and I told her we were going to such and such a place.  She said, "Oh, can we go somewhere else?"

I immediately turned the car around and took her home.  Date over.  

Why?  Because she wasn't content to be with ME, where I wanted to go.  I was training her.  David and Jeff were totally pumped about this.  I was learning to be a real man.  Suzie was confused and hurt.

Why am I saying all this?  Because it is all true.  I have totally repented of this sort of behavior, but there are many families out there who were trained to be like this and still are!

Yes, there were lots of good things in the Assembly.

Brent

[Tim]

I can vouche for a more recent 'dating' practice in SLO, mine.  It was nothing like what I see described here.  I let Jeff know about how many times we were getting together each week.  At one point when I said 2 or 3.  He asked why not more, but I was too busy to fit anymore time in.  We went out for dinner, went for walks, prayed together, talked about everything under the sun, our hope and dreams our childhood.  

I was never told to rule my wife or anything like that.  There were no tests to see if she would follow or other tests to see if she would pass.  No asking her to do this or that to serve me.  Nobody even suggested that to me.  We went out and sought God's will and built our friendship.  We needed to see if we were going the same direction, if our dreams and apsirations were compatible.  Did we enjoy each others' company without everyone else around?

I understand by stories from the past (and I don't doubt them) that things were pretty tweaked and that is/was horrible, but I haven't seen any pressure for stuff like that in my courting/dating or marriage.  I may be king, but she is the queen.  Christ is the head, but He serves, builds, upholds.

I'm all for getting things made right for the those who have been hurt by the bogus teaching that the man is the lord to be served and not the lord who serves, but I just thought that I'd give an example of something that went right.  

[editor]

Hi Tim

No doubt about it, things loosened up over the last 2 years.  Not everwhere, and in everycase, but in the dating area, there was a change.

However, if "spending time," was cool, other things were not.  The cover up, excommunication of me, George's pecadillos etc.  prove that plenty was quite wrong.  Jesus Christ and the Bible were right on.  Everything that didn't match up to this was not.

It takes time to sort it all out, but I am THANKFUL that you and Karen did not have any "Fly Beach Dating."  

However, far more people did, than didn't.

I like to look at the Geftakys group like a voyage on the QE 2.  The crew has noisy bad quarters, and they do all the work.  the common passenger gets OK food and accomodations, but they can't get into first class.

First class is five star all the way.  Different experience for each person, but they are all in the same boat, going to the same place.  It's OK for cruise ships, but NOT for a church.

Brent

[Eulaha L. Long]

I started a thread entitled "What does the Bible say about dasting?" Perhaps Tim and Brent would like to contribute your thoughts there as well.  We have been having quite a heated discussion about our view on dating!

[Eulaha L. Long]

dasting??? DATING!

[Heide]

I have a correction! Earlier I had called the wives out specifically of a meeting that I had thought took place in SLO. Only to discover that the only wife present at that meeting was Marcie. I have apologized to Nancy face to face and hope to Jenny as well. Oops....

[Oscar]

Dasting?  Dating?

  The rule was, "Don't you dast date".
Tom

[sfortescue]

For anybody whose goal it is to have sound beliefs and clear thoughts, nothing is more helpful than adverse criticism.  It's called REALITY.  However, there is a state of mind that continues to hold on to and refuses to question its perspective in spite of the clear evidence presented by adverse critics.  It's called DELUSION.

Christ came speaking the TRUTH.  It was religious men who refused to own they were lost and separated themselves from Him by their system of religion.  These men, looked up to by others as leaders, were told that harlots and tax collectors had better hopes of heaven than themselves.

"How often would I have gathered thy children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and AND YE WOULD NOT."

Again, the term is DELUSION.