"Papa" vs "Daddy" a telling sign

[Arthur]

This is something that I tucked away as "interesting" when I was in the assembly, and bring it forward as "alarming confirmation" now.  

Have you ever noticed that some leading brothers and families had their children call them "papa", whereas some had their children call them "daddy"?  

It seemed more than a coincidence to me that, as least in my assembly, the leading brothers who had their children call them "papa" were workers and were more blindly loyal to George and David then the leading brother who had his children call him "daddy".

Follow this:

My parents are from Holland.  In my dad's home he called his parent's "papa" and "mama".  
I consider that to be typical of European homes.  
But my dad Americanized as he grew up here, and so in our family I called my parents "dad" and "mom".  

George's family was from Europe and hence they used the European "papa" and "mama".  David G. also required that his children call him and his wife "papa" and "mama".  
I may be wrong on this, but to my knowledge, not too many typical American families in this region use "papa" but rather "dad" or "daddy".  Why then would these families use "papa"--isn't it to show their loyalty and likeness to those who were over them in the ministry?!

Isn't it interesting yet deeply sorrowful that the control and influence of these cult leaders was so pervasive that it extended and still extends all the way into the very terms of endearment used within families?

Now you tell me that these people aren't messed up.  Their childrens' lives were wholly submersed in this matrix of evil.  The nomenclature is only an external sign of a deeper problem. It's like David G. or George G. is right there, inbetween you and your children.  He is there, in you, telling you how you need to treat them, how you need to live--all for the ministry, must keep up appearances, must keep these kids in line, must maintain order in the "house of God", must maintain loyalty, must be a slave to George G!  Is that how you should raise your children?!

God help us all.

[CBrown]

Arthur,

I think you are a knucklehead.  I was called papa long before I knew what an assembly was.  I know several others who also go by "papa".  The vast, vast majority of "assembly" dads I know are called "dad".

Isn't there a more pressing issue to discuss?

[Bluejay]

Arthur your post was one of the best yet!  Very well said.

I am convinced it was the leaderships objective to:

A.  Make children of the assembly stick out like a sore thumb amongst its piers.

B.  Use the children as a way for assembly parents to prove that they were "indeed making a stand".

The mama and papa thing are both very bizarre.  Looking back on things, the way that the leadership of the assembly took different issues to the extreme was also ridiculous and abusive.

First...Why all the meetings, and functions.  Overkill!!!  There is just not any need for a child to spend 12 hours on Sunday, and then Wed, Thurs and weekends with any religious group...Particularly this one.  There absolutely has to be balance in a child's life.  Sports, school functions, etc. are an important part of a child's upbringing.  I can totally understand a parent taking a stand and saying that Sunday worship comes before everything else...But having to miss normal activities on occasion for a Bible Study or a prayer meeting is just ridiculous.  When doing this, parents should realize that they are not teaching their children to choose Christ first, rather they are teaching their children to resent Christ.

Secondly...Why in the world would assembly leaders nix all of the holidays.  For example, I realize that Halloween back in the dinasour era was probably celebrated by a small few as a satanic holiday.  But pulling your children out of school, not allowing them to put on a costume and go door to door is just ridiculous.  There was not one time growing up where one of my friends said to me

"Gee, we had a great time trick or treating, I was Bat Man!  After we got done, we went and slaugtered a cow in the name of Satan!"

Christmas...I've read Tim Geftakys' masterpiece (I think it just missed out on a Pulitzer) about why saints shouldn't celebrate Christmas...Granted, Christmas wasn't when Christ was born, and blah, blah, blah..What is the matter with taking a day  that everyone else in this country seems to get excited about and spending it with family...Doing something nice, seeing relatives, exchanging gifts.

As far as both of the holidays and others go...What would be the matter with educating your children on what these holidays were about and turning it into a positive.  Once again, Im telling you this because I have been there...Taking this sort of a stand will be more of a turn off.  

Using the logic that one shouldn't celebrate Halloween because .00001% of the population at one time celebrated it in a satanic way is like saying people should denounce Christianity because George is an adulterer, David is a wife beater, and Tim is a thief.

Again, these are minor minor issues, but subjecting your children to being completely abnormal all of the time is just plain wrong. I am convinced that assembly leadership could put their spin on anything they wanted it to...I could just see the theme of a workers meeting this summer being the abolition of Mondays....

"Dear friends, we are no longer going to recognize Mondays as a day of the week.  Our reasons are as such...First, every seven years, Halloween falls on a Monday.  Therefore it must be a wicked day.  Secondly, no assemblies have meetings on Mondays, therefore if God didn't lead us to have a meeting, Monday must not exist.  Finally, we feel that Monday night football is way to much of a distraction, therefore by not recognizing Mondays, in our minds MNF will no longer exist. We need to make sure that our children at school take a stand on what will now be called Tuesday part A.  If they do not abide, and by chance say the word Monday, we must give them 456 consequences".

Parents who are still a part of the assembly...Take your children and run for your lives!

[Matt]

Arthur,

I think you are a knucklehead.  I was called papa long before I knew what an assembly was.  I know several others who also go by "papa".  The vast, vast majority of "assembly" dads I know are called "dad".

Isn't there a more pressing issue to discuss?

Hi Cbrown,
You are absolutely right. Can you imagine analyzing what children call their parents in the assembly? The emphasis on your post should be "at least in my assembly." Guess what the children of leading brothers in our assembly called their parents: dad and mom. I'm afraid we have assumptions flying out of control again. If  these children called their parents "papa and mama", it HAD to be because of GG, right? There's just no other explanation. Come on now, arthur, that was a silly post. AND HARDLY EVIDENCE THAT WE WERE IN A CULT BECAUSE THE LEADING BROTHERS AT *YOUR* ASSEMBLY WERE CALLED "PAPA".

[Bluejay]

Arthur,

I think you are a knucklehead.  I was called papa long before I knew what an assembly was.  I know several others who also go by "papa".  The vast, vast majority of "assembly" dads I know are called "dad".

Isn't there a more pressing issue to discuss?

Hi Cbrown,
You are absolutely right. Can you imagine analyzing what children call their parents in the assembly? The emphasis on your post should be "at least in my assembly." Guess what the children of leading brothers in our assembly called their parents: dad and mom. I'm afraid we have assumptions flying out of control again. If  these children called their parents "papa and mama", it HAD to be because of GG, right? There's just no other explanation. Come on now, arthur, that was a silly post. AND HARDLY EVIDENCE THAT WE WERE IN A CULT BECAUSE THE LEADING BROTHERS AT *YOUR* ASSEMBLY WERE CALLED "PAPA".

Matt

You are absolutely right....

For example, when David Geftakys is sentenced to prison for beating his wife, or when Tim Geftakys is sentenced to prison for tax evasion, and a fellow inmate there makes them their "mama" that under no circumstances would mean that they are in a cult.

[editor]

Hey Arthur

I think you are right, with the exception that it was limited to SLO, and to the places where David or Betty had a real stronghold.

In SLO, you are absolutely correct.  Also, many of the husbands called their wives, "lover," because that's what David called Judy.

Also, David had old muscle cars, and so did other LB's.  David poured the oil out of the Bernstein's dressing, and so did the other training homes.  David had 3-bean salad with every meal, so did the other homes.

David used a fruit in a blender to top pancakes with, and so did the other houses, etc.  

You obervation is correct, but I think it is limited in scope as I mentioned above.

Here's one that hits a little harder.  Matt training and no fussing.  They were nationwide.

(Matt, we are not referring to you! )

Brent

[Arthur]

Yes, quite right.  I had a hunch the "papa"-styled cloning had more to do with David and the assemblies that he influenced.  I should have been more explicit in stating as much and that people in other assemblies may not have witnessed such a phenomenon.  
However, Brent hammers the predominant point home well by pointing out that familial terms of endearment is only one of many evidences of coercive persuasion accomplished by the Geftakysi in ALL assemblies.  

[Arthur]

Using the logic that one shouldn't celebrate Halloween because .00001% of the population at one time celebrated it in a satanic way is like saying people should denounce Christianity because George is an adulterer, David is a wife beater, and Tim is a thief.

Good points, Bluejay.  Isn't it interesting that good Christian people who go to what the G's deemed "worldly, compromised churches" aren't so strict on these things, but people like the Geftakysi, who are guilty of adultery, coersion, extortion, spiritual abuse, etc. made a big deal about them.  
Kinda makes one scratch one's head.  
And yet it is no wonder, for that is the nature of pharisees--devouring widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers.
Why, Judas betrayed Jesus with a kiss.  What sickness is in the hearts of men.

[Arthur]

Matt, food for thought.  Do you start your prayers by saying something about the Heavenly Father, and end your prayers by saying something like,  "In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.  Amen."

Ask yourself why.