- IS IT TRUE!?!

For anybody who's goal it is to have a sound beliefs and clear thoughts, nothing is more helpful than adverse criticism. It's called REALITY. However, there is a state of mind that continues to hold on to and refuses to question it's perspective in spite of the clear evidence presented by adverse critics. It's called DELUSION.

Christ came speaking the TRUTH. It was religious men who refused to own they were lost and separated themselves from Him by their system of religion. These men, looked up to by others as leaders, were told that harlots and tax collectors had better hopes of heaven than themselves.

"How often would I have gathered thy children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and AND YE WOULD NOT."

Again, the term is DELUSION

Dear Heide :)

How can you say, "I am clueless," and then say, "Does anyone see any fruit of repentance out of this sham?" ???

To answer your questions:

1.) What is going on in SLO is that a few very confused people are coming to realize that they are free. At the same time, a few very confused people are trying to get a terminally ill patient to rise up and labor, even as before. In short, some have seen that it is over, while others hope and pray that new wine can indeed go into old wineskins. If any part of the group is to coninue in SLO, which should not be a priority, then the entire old system must be razed. This has not occurred as of right now. Things are not perfect in SLO, or anywhere else, with the exception of Champaign, Ill, which has totally disbanded. However, they are radically different, and there is right now the best opportunity to make the right choices. Some say it should go faster. Others say, "Be patient." However, if this is of God, it will go forth in his timing. It is not over.

2.) As for people not contacting you Heide, this is a real shame. They did call you a liar, I heard it myself. The leaders should be ashamed of themselves for not immediately contacting you. This illustrates a problem. They know that George is gone, and understand that many bad things happened "on their watch," but they fail to come to grips with their complicity in the matter. The prospect of admitting we are wrong, when we so adamantly proclaimed our righteousness, and slandered our enemies is a very large piece of humble pie. You can't eat this big of a piece all at once, but you must start with the first bite, so to speak. They sit at the table, and are holding their forks, but they haven't really started eating, except for Ray and Danny.

3.) The leadership must step down.

The entire SLO group came to Calvary SLO this AM, and many of them were totally blessed. God is working, but things are not finished.

Heide? I will personally let them know that you deserve a serious apology, but it is unlikely that you will get it until 1-3 happen.

Brent

I would like to start by saying a sincere "Thank You!!" to those who created this forum, and also to those have who have participated in it. Although the spirit of it has not always been Christ-like, and there have been some generalities that have been thrown around, the truth of many of the things that have been laid out are evident and CANNOT be denied. This forum has had, and is having, a tremendous impact on me (and many others) and is helping renew my perspective on many, many things. In some ways it has been hard, but I am thankful to God for it. So, thank you again.

I would like to add one thing to consider. Some are asking, "Is it True?" I can attest to the fact that it is. God has exposed sin in my own life, and I have had the blessed opportunity to begin the process of making things right with people. And, I have seen it in the lives of others. God is getting real breakthrough and healing is starting to take place. My concern is that some of you are attempting to decide what the true condition of certain people are and the "conditions" of their true repentence. And, don't seem to be satisfied with what you are hearing or seeing in their responses. In some cases, this dissatisfaction may be perfectly justifiable. In others, I do not think it is. Please do not misunderstand me. You haven't "hurt my feelings." But, you cannot play God in peoples' lives either. The fact that I have done that to others in certain ways is something I have asked forgiveness for. It has grieved me terribly. If you do this unjustly, you will be doing exactly what you have been trying to expose in this forum.

I humbly request that everyone please keep this in mind as they offer up their opinions on this BB. Please accept this as a friendly thought. That is how it was meant to be. (Tone is a hard thing to communicate in e-speak)

Please be patient. God truly IS at work as He always has been (no reference to the ignorant and absurd 7th day of creation teaching).

God bless you all, and may the posting continue.

Safe in the Arms of Jesus,

Joe

HI Joe

Thanks for the kind words about this forum. In time, we will all settle down a little bit, but most assembly folk aren't used to being able to interact with people who left years ago, and be able to speak their mind at the same time.

It is a VERY novel experience, so everyone is pretty much buzzing.

As for not Christ-like all the time, I was thinking about deleting all the posts that were not Christ-like. Is anyone out there opposed to this? ;)

God bless you Joe, and enjoy the forum!

Brent

What is the true definition of "Christ-like"?

When I read my Bible, Jesus showed a wide range of emotions, speech, and actions. From crying to anger to rejoicing. From holding little children to touching lepers to driving folks out of the temple with a whip. With that in mind, it makes it a little harder to put your finger on it.

In the lodge, certain emotions were "acceptable", while others were "not Christ-like". The leadership "lorded" this over the flock. They determined what was acceptable in order to maintain their control. But George could act however he wanted. And so could certain people.

My purpose in starting this thread was to make people think. Since the great news came out, there has been an influx of folks here that want to say "it's ok now, let's pick up the pieces and go on our way." I never bought that. Things are not ok. Practices and teachings need to change as well as apologies made. Sorry is good, facing reality is even better.

The judgemental tone of certain people on this BB proves that things are not well. "You shouldn't use that tone." "You are an angry person." (God is angry everyday!) "You should just let people alone, don't talk about doctrine or abusive practices." "This is a time of hugging". Those statements are non-reality.

So don't anyone think that their judgemental assembly ways are going to affect me. I don't buy it. I am no longer under the lodge's control. I am free. I don't have to perform for any judgemental person. God is my judge. He knows the motives in my heart. I will answer to Him. Jesus was not always "christ-like" according to the lodge's definition. The fanatics of His day said He was a wino, a glutton, and a devil. When they played the flute, He did not dance.

So.....what is Christ like? Who wants to be my judge? Who is right? If I commit adultery, that IS wrong. If I use a place of authority to control and shame others, that IS wrong! But why is it wrong to be strong enough to fight against injustices? Why is it wrong to stand up for victims and tell the truth? Why is it wrong to show a little "tone" in a message? God sees all of this.

No one would hear me 3 or 4 years ago. I guess now that I am proven right, what I say still means nothing. All the Boo-hoo's will get their way I'm sure. Just that they won't get their way with me!

I don't really have an opinion on whether or not the "not Chirst-like" posts should be removed...but the volume of silly posts is often hard to sift through when trying to keep up with the posts that are addressing very real issues of concern to those who are seeking enlightenment on all that has happened. (OK, sorry for the run on sentence)
Anyway, my idea was, maybe the little one liners and quips would be better to do on a chat forum... although there's never anyone on when I go to the chat room :'(...or to keep a truly Humor Only thread going....I love jokes, humor, laughter 8)as much as anyone...but when you're internet time is limited it is rather frustrating to have to sift through a bunch of one liners that seem alot like "inside jokes" to one who doesn't spend alot of time on this BB...and believe me I feel like I spend too much time on here as it is!
That is just my opinion...take it for what it's worth...I do enjoy this site and hope it continues to generate open and honest discussion and to glorify the Lord Jesus Christ!

"I would like to start by saying a sincere "Thank You!!" to those who created this forum, and also to those have who have participated in it. Although the spirit of it has not always been Christ-like, and there have been some generalities that have been thrown around, the truth of many of the things that have been laid out are evident and CANNOT be denied. This forum has had, and is having, a tremendous impact on me (and many others) and is helping renew my perspective on many, many things. In some ways it has been hard, but I am thankful to God for it. So, thank you again."

Did I miss something? Sounds as if someone is taking a bow or accepting an award. The things on this BB are serious. THose who helped to direct and administer the orders out of the great and infamous George are accountable. As far as the "conditions" of people ..... does that mean the the shepherds are actually opening their eyes now? They were closed to the goings on for WAY TO LONG! As far as to what can be attested or not attested one can truly only speak for themselves! The fact that leaders have spoken for ( AND AGAINST) others for a very long time is over! GOD is in CONTROL! Not the leadership. Opinions offered up are opinions of people that are personal and important to the one that offers it. How can you tell someone to have your opinion when it is theirs? That is a continued "CONTROL" issue that has been raging thru this lodge forever!
I do however agree with you on the quote : " But , you cannot play God in peoples' lives either"......glad to see that you are seeing this in your own life. But people have their hurts and their opinions, if they do not agree with yours, too bad. Welcome to the human race. Everyone is unique and different. WE have not all wedged ourselves in the "George and Betty" cookie cutters of life. Though that is exactly what the lodge has taught. If you become like them then you are accepted, and promoted. I am soooooo glad that God's ways are higher than mans...that HIS thoughts are not like our thoughts....they are above and beyond ours. He is out for our good! There is none like God! NONE!

No one would hear me 3 or 4 years ago. I guess now that I am proven right, what I say still means nothing. All the Boo-hoo's will get their way I'm sure. Just that they won't get their way with me!

Garth,

People have heard you loud and clear. They heard you then too, although they suppressed the truth. Same experience on my end. What you say means alot, which is why you should keep talking. The more facts and clear thinking the better!

Also, the Boo-hoo's will NOT get their way. (Exactly who are they?) This is a dicey business, and no one could have guessed the speed at which everything has transpired. It is far from over, but the fact that we are able to communicate with people who thought we were "The Enemy," less than a month ago is something to keep in mind.

At this point in time, people need to hear the truth, and we should be like the Apostle Paul, to the ex-assembly as ex-assembly, to the current assembly, as current members. (Yes, I took some liberty with all things to all men, but I think it applies here, mainly in the area of tone. Content should be truth, no matter who the audience.)

Brent

: B. Tr0ckman January 28, 2003, 08:24:30 PM

Of course I'm kidding!

Although, I did delete an entire thread that said, "pay not attention to this thread."

Every post (14 pages) seemed to have only the letter "A" or "Q." Seemed silly to me, and pointless. The person doing it just wanted to up his posting status, so I deleted it, because he could keep his stars even though the thread is gone.

Yeah....about that. For some reason i can not PM you, so i just wanted to apologize to you specifically and to everyone else in general. In retrospect, it was a stupid thing to do and not at all as amusing as i thought i would be when i started the script running last night. I did not do it for the stars, but to see if i could.

You were perfectly on track to delete that thread, it was a pointless endevour of a bored soul. :-\

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General Discussion => Any and All Topics => : freebird January 25, 2003, 11:09:25 AM