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Author Topic: Assemblies Continuing to Meet is a Horrible Thing For the Children  (Read 14792 times)
MGov
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« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2003, 10:43:28 pm »

Yes, what I heard is accurate.  It is possible that Tim G is only preaching the Bible study in San Diego to be a blessing.  However, this possibility flies in the face of history, and the concept of repentance and humility.  Tim knew about his brother's violence and did nothing.  Don't you think he should take a little time off before leading and teaching again?
Brent

I agree with you on this point Brent.
M
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Matt
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« Reply #16 on: May 13, 2003, 11:41:01 pm »


Yes, what I heard is accurate.  It is possible that Tim G is only preaching the Bible study in San Diego to be a blessing.  

Brent

Brent,
You really have an obligation to be truthful. You've been told that Tim G. is not preaching any Bible Study in San Diego more than once. Why do you insist on lying?
- matt
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Bluejay
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« Reply #17 on: May 13, 2003, 11:56:41 pm »

Matt

Giving ministry once is to many...If anyone needs counseling - its him!

What on earth could he possibly be preaching about???  He learned everything from his father who has turned out to be a fraud!  The ministry itself  was a complete and total fraud.  You say he has been estranged from his father for a while now...I guarantee you that if they could have covered George abd Davids sins up, it would be business as usual.  The ministry that Tim was a huge part of, bought into, and made a living off of was just plain wrong and abusive.  

Did Tim Geftakys all of the sudden trip, hit his head and all of the sudden  wake up and a have brand new vision for his  ministry!  Is he now all of the sudden humble???  Is his ministry now all of the sudden going to make sense??? Is the money in the box "in the back part of the room" all of the sudden going to go to legitimate needs???  

Maybe with this new vision they can start another grade school and his wife can play prinicipal again...Of course only if she can pull herself away from writing pamphlets that teach young parents how to emotionally and psychologically abuse children.

Bring it on Matt??? What business can he possibly have preaching period!!! If anyone needs direction, its him!




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editor
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« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2003, 01:44:45 am »

I would like to share some of the thoughts I had while on 'vacation' from the BB.  Smiley

I often go out sailing, where it is quiet, and things make sense.  Sailing is good, because if a person doesn't do things right, or tries to deny which way the wind blows, they never get anywhere.  You have to be observant, honest, truthful and skillfull, in order to pilot a sailboat in Central California.

That being said, the boat is a wonderful place to think, none better.

I came up with a story, of which I am only going to share a skeleton version.


Every cult has 3 vicious members, the next one proportionally more vicious than the former.  These members are servants of the Devil.

DeadTruth is the first, BlindLoyalty the second, and Manipulator the most vicious of all, being the third.

DeadTruth is the first.  This person never lies, and always speaks the truth.  The problem is that it is not spoken out of love.  Speaking the truth in love is not what Deadtruth does.  Deadtruth speaks the truth for every reason besides love.  When people hear what Deadtruth has to say, they become bitter, angry and defeated.  They may leave the cult, but they won't follow Jesus.

Blindloyalty is even worse.  This person won't hear the truth if it conflicts with the cult's version of reality.  Facts mean nothing.  The most heinous abuses can be written off as petty events.  If the leader is caught in the act of gross sin, blindloyalty says, "well, we all sin."  BlindLoyalty has the ability to forgive his abusers of anything they may do to him.  Slaps in the face, theft and abuse are things he gladly accepts.  He sees these things as necessary for his perfection.

Manipulator is the worst of all.  Manipulator points out the faults of Deadtruth, every single time Deadtruth opens his mouth.  In time, everyone comes to hate Deadtruth, and learns to ignore the true things that he says.  If someone tells the truth in love, Manipulator labels this person as Deadtruth.  This teaches the cult members to hate the truth, because they associate it with Deadtruth and then the cult members won't pay any attention to truth, even the truth as it is in Jesus.

When Blindloyalty speaks, Manipulator is immediately right there complimenting him.  Manipulator praises Blinloyalty and then promptly comdemns disloyalty of any kind.  If blindloyalty tells blatant lies to protect the group, his praise is doubled. If anyone ever speaks anything the least bit negative about the group, Manipulator comes in and accuses them of being "disloyal," and "divisive."

Manipulator's one weakness is that he never speaks about facts, or events.  Everything he has to say is personal in nature, and is directed at slandering the character of another.  When a member must be exposed, in order to further the agenda of the group, Manipulator leaves the truth to Deadtruth, who quickly slices the offending member into tiny pieces.  Manipulator, having accomplished his goal then turns the tables on deadtruth and uses his lack of love to suppress those who tell the truth in the future.

By always supporting Blindloyalty, Manipulator is able to instill guilt in everyone, so that in time, they are able to label their own thoughts as bitter and misguided if they ever think anything negative about their group.  Should they ever entertain the truth, even in their thoughts, they are immediately out from under Manipulator's praise, and fall under the scorn reserved for Deadtruth.  They are trapped.

The solution to this?

First of all, the truth needs to be listened to, even from Deadtruth.  Along with this truth, the Gospel of the Grace of God needs to be clearly taught.  This will enable people who hear the truth, to not be discouraged by it, but intead opens the door to a love relationship with Jesus Christ.

BlindLoyalty needs to be criticized.  No more praise for this one, his loyalty is actually idolatry, and needs to be exposed as such.  In doing so, BlindLoyalty is often saved, because it is quite easy for him to put his loyalty towards Jesus instead of the group.

Manipulator is a little more difficult to deal with.  He doesn't give up so easy, and when people try to pin him down, he continues with the same tricks.  You lie!  That's not loving!  You are ungrateful! All you do is tear down!  You only remember the one bad thing! and so on.  Just remember that he NEVER has any facts to back up his accusations.  There is no witnesses, no paper trail, and no refutation of the truth, only accusations.  It takes a steady hand and a calm spirit to fight with Manipulator.

Manipulator can only be exposed over time, by a new member who's name is Patience.

like I said, its a skeleton.

Brent
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David Mauldin
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« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2003, 02:37:44 am »

 John Bunyon couldn't have said it better!


  Brent compared to when when you first left would you say your estimation about being deceived has increased?

To me people in the Geftakys Assembly look 1000 times weirder than they did at first and they continue to do so more.  Man was I really that loony?
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sfortescue
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« Reply #20 on: May 14, 2003, 03:59:52 am »

Tim G. never preached at this Bible Study by the way... He taught the one on campus, not the one at Lee's house.

Yes, what I heard is accurate.  It is possible that Tim G is only preaching the Bible study in San Diego to be a blessing.  

Brent

Brent,
You really have an obligation to be truthful.
You've been told that Tim G. is not preaching any Bible Study in San Diego
more than once. Why do you insist on lying?
- matt

Which thing is incorrect?

Is it that the meeting on campus is not a Bible study?

Or are you complaining about the tense of the word "is" like that famous quote
of Clinton when he said, "It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is."
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editor
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« Reply #21 on: May 14, 2003, 07:23:59 am »

Hi Dave

Thank you for your kind words regarding my story, but I do think comparing me to Bunyan is a little over the top.  How many millions of times do I have to tell you not to exaggerate? Wink

When I look back, I don't see myself so much as looney, as really sad and frustrated.  It's like I see in color now.  I am also embarrassed from my past service to Geftakys.  Nevertheless, I am not ashamed of the Gospel.  He brought me through it all, and now I can enjoy my freedom in Christ.

Brent

PS--don't ever dis' the Beatles...ever.
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Matt
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« Reply #22 on: May 14, 2003, 09:39:55 am »

Ok, I have been requested to divulge some information about Tim G to help clear up some misunderstandings here. I have read this entire thread and I do not see where I ever say in the present tense that Tim G is teaching a campus Bible study. However, the past tense can be misleading "taught" could mean he taught yesterday or he taught 10 yrs. ago here. Here are the facts for anyone interested:
Tim G. taught the campus bible study at San Diego State University every other week during the 2001-2002 school year. He never taught at any of the other Bible studies in San Diego that I'm aware of. I'm sorry if I was ambigous, but I thought using the past tense meant the past? And despite accusations from someone I won't name, I was NOT trying to mislead the board. Thanks!
- Matt
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editor
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« Reply #23 on: May 14, 2003, 09:49:22 am »

Ok, I have been requested to divulge some information about Tim G to help clear up some misunderstandings here. I have read this entire thread and I do not see where I ever say in the present tense that Tim G is teaching a campus Bible study. However, the past tense can be misleading "taught" could mean he taught yesterday or he taught 10 yrs. ago here. Here are the facts for anyone interested:
Tim G. taught the campus bible study at San Diego State University every other week during the 2001-2002 school year. He never taught at any of the other Bible studies in San Diego that I'm aware of. I'm sorry if I was ambigous, but I thought using the past tense meant the past? And despite accusations from someone I won't name, I was NOT trying to mislead the board. Thanks!
- Matt

OK folks:

There you have it.  Tim is not currently preaching in San Diego.  He did preach in the past, which of course we all knew.  The important thing is that, according to Matt, who lives there and is connected with people who are in contact with Tim, Tim is NOT teaching in San Diego.

We need to be careful with facts and words.  Some of us read Matt's post, and deduced that Tim was not teaching at Dave Lee's, but on the campus, because that is what the post said.  However, Matt was really trying to say that Time USED to, last year, teach on the campus, NOT at Dave Lee's.

It is still a fact that Tim is again leading in Fullerton.  I mean this, and am using my words carefully.  I am also happy that he is not teaching in San Diego, but I would not be surprised if he wanted to again.

I think this is a good example of owning up to mistakes, and correcting them.  This happens all the time, in all aspects of life, but it takes a quality person to own up to it.

Let's put this one in the "solved" file.

Brent
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vbeers
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« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2003, 01:45:43 am »

Matt,

Just curious...How long have you been a part of the GA and what prompts you stay involved now?  Actually, let me correct myself...the GA doesn't technically exist so how long have been involved with ex-assemblyites?
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